An Exclusive Interview with Brother Runhuan Liu by Good Land Quarterly of Taiwan Full-time Training Center
Concerning Brother Runhuan Liu
He Being an Interesting Person
I was born in a Buddhist family. I received the Lord during my study in a Christian school. Later, when I was working in Chungking, I contacted a cellist, who had just entered into the Lord’s recovery, was saved six months ago, and ever studied in Moscow. He always invited me to attend conferences. Soon I turned to the Lord’s Recovery. At that time, I loved to attend meetings very much. The impression that Brother Nee left on me was that he was an interesting person, whether in spiritual aspect or in the aspect of knowlege, possessing an all-inclusive knowlege.
But the Souls Who Love Him Truly / Let Woe Come or Bliss
During my stay in Chungking, I had worked in the pharmaceutical factory with Brother Nee in a large office. However, we had no opportunity to talk with each other. He was sitting before his office desk and almost did not move around. At that time, the office in the pharmaceutical factory was located in the downtown area in Chungking city, whereas the factory was located in the suburb. Because there was a great need of DDT to sterilize after the Anti-Japanese war, he was desperate to manufacture this kind of product. One day, as I opened the newspaper, I just saw that the contents of the whole coverage mentioned that Watchman Nee left Golgotha aside, just caring for making his DDT. This was the opposing word from Christianity. Because at that time it was only him who could produce DDT, and it was very easy to obtain the profit by making this kind of product. However, Brother Nee’s intention was to care for the need of the co-workers’ living. Although he was suffering misunderstanding, he did not refute.
In order to care for those saints who were behind the battle front, he transported the medicine in Shanghai pharmaceutical factory inland, behind the battle front ship by ship. Although every time the shipment was not smooth and was confiscated repeatedly, and the saints in the church in Shanghai also misunderstood and opposed him that he could not minister in the church, he still continued to do according to the burden that the Lord had given to him. Later, in the fellowship meeting for Brother Nee’s returning to his ministry, those who opposed him before asked him why he operated the pharmaceutical factory, he answered with a very sorrowful word: “I went to run business, just like a widow with a group of children. I was compelled to remarry. Because many co-workers among us passed away with tuberculosis because of the malnutrition.” He counted the co-workers for the saints to know. Even Brother Philip Luan also passed away due to the tuberculosis. This compelled him to operate the pharmaceutical factory. With respect to others’ opinions or speaking, Brother Nee did not care about.
Concerning Brother Watchman Nee
My Future Being to Be either Raptured or Martyred
I not only enjoyed Brother Nee’s rich word he had supplied, but also saw his practical pattern. Once when he was releasing the messages concerning The Orthodoxy of the Church in a meeting, a report was heard that someone wanted to shoot Brother Nee! Immediately brothers and sisters in the meeting felt very nervous and did not know whether the meeting would be suspended or not. In reality, it would be difficult whether the meeting was concluded or not. Because if it was stopped, the saints would not receive the benefit; if it continued, nobody dared to shoulder this risk. Eventually, the meeting continued as usual. Therefore, we could infer that this was not of brothers’ decision. If this was not Brother Nee’s decision, who dare shoulder such a risk? And I received the benefit from this matter. Because once I was in a place where I was serving, I heard a report from one brother, who said: “Brother Liu, be careful! Someone wants to shoot you!” This kind of feeling was just like that of someone wanting to shoot Brother Nee. As long as I heard of this, I would definitely flee for my life. But it was very wonderful. Suddenly Brother Nee’s experience came to me at that time, therefore I said to myself: “Isn’t Brother Nee’s life better than my life? Is my life bigger than his life? If someone wants to shoot me, let him shoot me! ” Brother Nee was God’s servant and absolutely faithful toward the Lord. And he had ever said: “my future is to be either raptured or martyred.” This was also my heart desire that my future was to be either raptured or martyred. I did not have the third choice. So, if someone wanted to shoot me, let him shoot me. Therefore, I had a very deep impression on this matter concerning Brother Nee. This was a great supply to me. If there was no such a pattern as him, when this kind of things happened, I just had to escape. If Brother Nee had escaped, I also escaped indeed. However, he did not escape, I dare not escape either. He was really the best pattern the Lord granted to us for the ministry.
Brother Witness Lee—the One Carrying Out the Divine Revelation
Brother Witness Lee (1905-1997) continued Brother Watchman Nee’s ministry received from the Lord to release the lofty revelation concerning God’s eternal economy in the Bible and present the ultimate goal of God’s economy that God became man that man may become God in life and nature but not in Godhead to constitute the Body of Christ, consummating in the New Jerusalem, the universal incorporation of the union and mingling of divinity with humanity to bring the Lord’s present recovery to the high peak of the divine revelation and raise up over 2,000 churches on all six continents to reach the high peak of the propagation.
Concerning Brother Witness Lee
His Perfecting of Me Completely Depending on His Teaching by Example
The first place where I went out to serve was Taoyuan. I considered myself not good material, but Brother Lee had his unique perfecting of me and also was willing to spend himself for me. At that time, we rented a large factory to meet in. Every time he passed by Taoyuan while travelling southward, he would come to the factory. Outside the factory was a big yard where there were only oil lamps and a large square table. We used that table to pray, eat, and meet. On one occasion, when we concluded our prayer meeting, Brother Lee appeared nearly at 10:00 P.M. He said: “Brother Liu, I wanted to live here.” Then I said: “I’m afraid not. Because here is dirty and stinking, you can’t live here. There is still the train at 10:30 P.M., I would buy a ticket for you as quickly as possible.” But he said: “No! I would definitely live here! Since you could live here, so could I!” He was just such a person. Hence, I was subdued within my heart.
Concerning the details of the living, Brother Lee’s perfecting of me completely depended on his teaching by example. Teaching by example is more important than teaching by word of mouth. For example, he arranged a brother in Cheeloo University to coordinate with me to minister the word. This brother was a good speaker. I admired him very much and also hoped him to lead me to move on. However, he was not willing to overstep the portion that Brother Lee had measured for him and stay within his limit to be unwilling to lead me. This was the influence that Brother Lee had exerted on him that he was the one having a sense of measure.
Concerning Brother Witness Lee
Completely Taking Him as the Pattern
The principle of my doing things was that I did not turn away from Brother Lee’s heart desire. Whatever was emphasized by Brother Lee, I would absolutely emphasize. I completely took him as the pattern. For example, when the elders concluded their meeting, they would invite Brother Lee to come in and told him what they had decided for him to correct and adjust. Every time he came into the elders’ room, he would take me as well. Then I would know how to decide and arrange the things in the church and the way before them. Because the recorder was not available at that time, Brother Lee would ask me to take the notes of his messages and fellowship. Therefore, I would take a notebook, thinking that his word would be published in The Ministry of the Word magazine. Although later he did not use it, this gave me a great help. I completely took him as the pattern.
Brother Lee always had a tape measure in his pocket，so I followed his example to measure something wherever I went and consider how to build up the deacon’s office and the elders’ room to perfect the saints. Therefore, wherever I went, they would know Brother Liu would measure something. This was altogether according to Brother Lee. Whatever he asked me to do, I would do.
Concerning many things such as marriages and funerals, etc. that I had not thought about, Brother Lee would give me a new leading. Brother Lee said that the marriages and funerals were something before God. God arranged and decided everything. There was no need to follow the set of the world. Therefore, I told saints: “If there was someone marrying, and he hoped that the church would help him on this matter, then he should listen to the leading of the church. Concerning the funeral, he also need to listen to the church. Brothers and sisters would gather together to sing, pray, and comfort.” Later I came to Gangshan where there was an Air Force Academy. Because the air crash happened frequently, and our brothers sometimes were also in the air crash; for this reason, when I fellowshipped with saints regarding how to serve concerning this matter, we just supported in one accord. Even the airmen were moved when they saw this and said: “You are so different, your funeral was conducted in a very fresh way, yet make man feel warm and comfortable. This is very real without any pretentiousness.” Therefore, if we follow Brother Lee’s teaching, we would have the Lord’s presence whatever we do.
The Inheritance That the Two Brothers Had Left Being Rich and Sufficient
The Lord’s Recovery is not an organization, neither does it consist in practices. Instead, the Lord’s recovery consists in the Lord Himself. The Lord has shown us specifically that He raised up the ministry of the word for His specific commission and also raised up the prophets to present the Lord’s word to us. Hence, we must know the Ministry of the New Testament that we can be always kept in the central lane of the Lord’s Recovery. If we did not follow these two brothers to continue to move on in the Lord’s Recovery, we would bear much responsibility.
I have always been feeling that the Lord’s Recovery could withstand tests. God is responsible for us and also for the church. Although several turmoils took place, it still turned out that the Lord did not abandon or forsake His Recovery. The Lord has been strengthening His Recovery, and this strengthening is for all the localities, not just for a certain locality.
The Lord indeed had mercy on me. Although I did not have gift and ability, I poured forth my whole life to devote myself into the Lord’s Recovery. Thank the Lord that He had granted us the two brothers before us. Although they had passed away, the inheritance that they left was rich and sufficient.